Staying Solo with Maggie Patterson

Andréa Jones [00:00:00]:
If you've been on the Internet for any number of years, you've heard the age old advice, hire a team, build a team, hire more people, and then hire some more. And if you are like, I don't know if that advice works for me, this episode is for you. I have the amazing Maggie Patterson coming on the show today to talk about her new book, Staying Solo, as well as, well, how you can do that yourself. But first, a word from our sponsor. Riverside is the all in one podcast recording and editing tool that I use for this Right Here show. I use it to edit not only the audio in the video, it is like chef's kiss, magical, making the entire process so, so easy. Plus I love their magic AI clips. Their little AI robot in the background pulls out the most impactful moments of the episodes without me having to comb through and do it myself.

Andréa Jones [00:00:50]:
Resizes them for social media. So those vertical videos you see on TikTok and them for social media. So those vertical videos you see on TikTok and reels, those all come from magic AI inside of Riverside. It's literally one click. It spits out 10 clips. I pick the best one and away I go saves me so much time. If you wanna get on the Riverside train, check it out today, the links in the show notes, and make sure to use my code drea, d r e a, at checkout to get 15% off your membership. Welcome to episode number three fifty nine of the Mindful Marketing podcast.

Andréa Jones [00:01:21]:
I'm so excited to have you all here today. And Maggie, thank you so much for being on the show again.

Maggie Patterson [00:01:25]:
Yeah. Well, thank you for keep inviting me back. I appreciate it.

Andréa Jones [00:01:28]:
Honestly, this is 100% selfish, because I just love your brain. And I just want to pick your brain just publicly for everyone else to hear as well. So I'm excited about that. But one of the things that I really admire about you is you have really strong stance and a really strong opinion about some of the things that are really the antithesis of what the big bro y online business y people say. And for years, you know, there's this common advice of, like, to scale, you have to build a team. So let's start with this big question. What's the deal with staying solo?

Maggie Patterson [00:02:03]:
Well, the deal is I noticed this pattern. I work with service providers, some of which are micro agency owners, and then some of which are true, you know, done for you solo service providers. And early on, when I started working with this group, I just assumed, like, I had scaled into a micro agency that everyone wanted to do that. But I kept having my clients come to me and say, Becky, I don't want a team. I don't wanna do this. I don't wanna do that. And I'm like, oh, this is a thing. And they felt really awkward about it.

Maggie Patterson [00:02:35]:
They felt bad. And a lot of the messages they were getting kind of in that bigger business ecosystem was, like, they were playing small, they were capping their growth, they're limiting their potential, you know, all the mindset things, and, like, you're not going for it. And I've spent a lot of time with my clients over the years reassuring them, talking about, like, hey. You don't have to accept that your income is gonna be capped just because you don't have a team. Like, how can we find a way to make this model work for you and optimize it? Because leadership is not for everyone, the risk and reward of having a team is not for everyone. And I think we've, you know, we've seen that over the last three, four years as we've watched a lot of people kind of walk back their teams. And not that that's a bad thing. We've seen also seen a lot of big businesses kind of what they call descale.

Maggie Patterson [00:03:28]:
They were not selling what they used to sell, which is fine. But the conversation has changed a lot in the last few years, and I want it to be like, hey. You know what? There still is a valid option here. You don't have to grow continuously. You don't have to keep chasing. You can build a a business that actually supports the kind of life you want and not in this, like, I'm gonna be sipping pina coladas on the beach kind of way. Like, you know, that's it's always like, I get it. It's like not freedom because I have a private jet.

Maggie Patterson [00:03:57]:
It's freedom because I can take my loved one to an appointment. Yeah. Like, really practical day to day things where you have the flexibility and, like, the freedom that's not about this, you know, artifice, this big fake image around you.

Andréa Jones [00:04:13]:
Yeah. A %. And I think this is the thing. Right? It's it's the option to be able to decide to do this. And I feel like, especially when people are trying to sell you something, they say, this is the one true path that there was no other options. And so you kind of feel like that, because you, like, buy into the hype. Right? And so I love that we're talking about this alternative method of doing things because there is another option. And I know for me personally too, like, I loved having a team.

Andréa Jones [00:04:41]:
It really support me in that season of my life. I loved having my agency. And then I did it. And then I sold it. And then and now it's just me and my assistant, Jemmy. And this is my season of life now. And I love this too. And I feel like there like, you can do both.

Andréa Jones [00:04:56]:
You can have both. You can you can, create a business that kinda fits with your life. And I love that that's kind of where you where you are. Can I ask, though, about your business specifically? Because you have a team too. So how do you balance, like okay. So talk to me about, like, your team, and then how do you work with your team but also, you know, preach the good word of staying solo?

Maggie Patterson [00:05:17]:
Well, I it's a really good question. And I mean, I it is something like one of my friends were initially pushing me to write the book because I've been talking about staying solo on my podcast, and then eventually rebranded my podcast. And I I was like, no. I can't do this. Like, I'm not solo. And they were like, Maggie, the majority of your clients are solo. And you have years of experience having been solo. Like, yes, I've had it in an a a micro agency for the last nine years, but the eleven years before that, I was on my own.

Maggie Patterson [00:05:46]:
And I'm also going through the process of, like, I run two businesses. So eventually, like, will my agency retire? Yes. And will I be truly solo? No. Because I don't wanna fire my sister who works for me full time. But, you know, we still run, like, a really scrappy little solo business in a lot of ways. So, try not to add a lot of layers of complications. So I always say I have the scrappy heart of a solo person in my you know, that's the kind of way I run things. I've never been like, let's have a big team.

Maggie Patterson [00:06:19]:
I don't like layers of complexity. I just I started on that path when I start growing my agency, and I was so much happier, like, by reducing the teen and having things be really, really slim. So for me, while I am not solo, I am in my heart.

Andréa Jones [00:06:35]:
Yeah. And I feel like that's the like, that's the energy that you bring into the work that you do is this, like, scrappiness to it. Right? And I do feel like as especially as small business owners, we kinda have to have that energy. Like, we don't have the, like, endless amounts of funding that some of these, like, larger Yeah. You know, companies have. And so, like, to be able to sustain our businesses, we do have to, like, think strategically and be really smart about how we use all of our funds, including, you know, paying our team and how that how that works out. So they I love that you have that. So, so you wrote the book, basically wrote the book on staying solo.

Andréa Jones [00:07:10]:
So what are what are some of the things, the common myths that you break down in the book about, like, staying solo?

Maggie Patterson [00:07:17]:
Yeah. So I think one of the biggest things is a lot of people have this hang up. They're not a real business If they're this team of one or they're just, like, you and your assistant. Right? People get really stuck on this. And the reality is is that the majority of businesses in The US and in the Western world, all the statistics point to are one person businesses. Yeah. You know? Like, we need to stop having the conversation around entrepreneurship, be really focused on scale, on rapid growth, on startups, on, like, the culture of entrepreneurship is very much this cultural celebration of being big when the reality of entrepreneurship is solo. So there's this real dinger.

Maggie Patterson [00:08:03]:
And the second I point that out to people, they go. And then the second thing is, is that, especially for people been operating in the kind of freelance online business world, they have a really inflated idea of what success looks like. In The US, the number I share in the book is the average one person business is making $43,000 a year. But meanwhile, in online business world, hundred k is like a joke.

Andréa Jones [00:08:32]:
You're only paying 6 figures.

Maggie Patterson [00:08:34]:
Right? Like and then it was 7 figures and 8 figures and all the figures. And the reality is is most people are creating these roles for themselves to have the freedom and flexibility and all the things that were promised. But ultimately, the goal isn't to make more money. The goal is to get the time freedom and everything else. And there's a lot of, data I bring into kind of the front part of the book to set up all my argument. And there's an entire, study of by state in The US of, hey. You know what? Why do people start their businesses? Money was very low on the list. And I think we get we start off with one thing and then more so over time, and we start to feel bad about ourselves.

Maggie Patterson [00:09:15]:
We start to really see, like, oh, I'm not earning enough. I'm not good enough. I should be hiring. I'm not legitimate. I'm a joke. And the reality is is out in the nonentrepreneurial online business world, this is the way business is. So why don't we just, like, drop all this crap, cut the bullshit out, and, like, actually focus on what our businesses need for us to find them to be simple and sustainable and to not take over our lives?

Andréa Jones [00:09:43]:
Yeah. Wow. So is that number, the the 43 k, is that, that's the profit or is that

Maggie Patterson [00:09:49]:
That top line revenue.

Andréa Jones [00:09:51]:
Top line. So I'm like, not even expenses. Wow. Okay. So, yeah, I feel like that is a huge reality check. And it's so funny too. You you talked about how, you know, when we first start our businesses, money isn't that high up on the list. And that is true for me too.

Andréa Jones [00:10:07]:
You got me thinking about, like, I started my business because I just like it. Like, I like marketing, and I like doing it. And then somewhere along the way, it's like more and more and more. And, like, even now, the a lot of the changes that I've made in my business is because I'm, like, shifting more into the things that I just I just like more. Yes. Even though now I make less than I have ever had in my business, actually. But I feel more fulfilled because I have more time to spend with my kids, which, like, right now is the most important thing to me. Right? And so it's so interesting how that money number sometimes overshadows our goals.

Andréa Jones [00:10:43]:
And I do think it is the marketing hype, right, of all of this. So so as as, as we go into this idea of, like, staying solo, what are some of the things we need to keep in mind so that we can have a sustainable business and maintain all those flexibility things that we want?

Maggie Patterson [00:10:59]:
Yeah. So the the very first thing is I talk about these six different pillars, and, basically, every pillar is a chapter or couple chapters in the book. And the very first one I talk about is salary. Because while it is not about the money, we all, you know, all things being equal, we all have businesses because we do need to make some money to, you know, feed, clothe, you know, survive, live in this, you know, capitalist health scare we're in. So one of the biggest things I see is people over investing in their business as solo business owners. We've all been there. We've all done it, buying all the things, chasing after the the dream TM, if you will. And we need to get very realistic about, like, how much money do I need from the business, and what activities do I need to be doing to ensure that I'm able to pay myself first? Because if you're not payable to pay yourself consistently from your business, what's gonna happen? You're gonna become burnt out.

Maggie Patterson [00:11:55]:
You're gonna become resentful. You are not gonna feel fulfilled by it. You need your at a minimum, your basic needs to be being met, and I want people to be doing better than their basic needs. Stop paying scammy business coaches on the Internet all your money and then getting the leftovers. I want you to reverse engineer that, and I have a calculator that goes with the book to be like, hey. This is how much money I need in my life. How much money do I actually need to be making? What are my expenses? And start to keep an eye on those numbers really strategically. And I brought in some really smart people into that chapter to talk about, like, how do you pay yourself? What should you be doing? Like, getting into the mechanics of the money that I'm not an expert on, but these smart money people, CPAs, bookkeepers actually are.

Andréa Jones [00:12:44]:
Yeah. I love that you you emphasize the money piece because I can't tell you how many times I've been on, like, consult calls with someone where they come in and they wanna hire my agency for services. And I'm asking them these questions like, okay, You know, how much revenue are you making per month? Or, how how much does it cost? Like, what's the cost of goods sold? Or things like that. And they don't know the answers. And it's like, we can't market. We can't even do anything until you know those answers. Otherwise, you're just paying me to post on social media for you. And, like, that's that's I mean, for fun, sure.

Andréa Jones [00:13:14]:
If you wanna do that, more power to you. But, like, we wanna run the business here. And so I love that you start with the with the numbers of it all because it it's the reality that we all have to face. And I think it's one of those things too where if you get caught up in the hype, you end up spending so much time on the busy work. I'm gonna call out marketing here. Okay. This is a marketing podcast. We spend so much time on busy work.

Andréa Jones [00:13:38]:
Sometimes it's marketing. And then we feel like nothing's working because we actually haven't looked at the numbers to see where that all lies. So, do you talk about marketing and how how do we how do we put marketing as the line item in all of this?

Maggie Patterson [00:13:51]:
You know, I really touch on marketing in the systems part of it because it is nobody wants especially as a solo business owner, no one wants to, like, systems. Do I really need system? And it's like, stop thinking of systems as, like, these things that, like, are going to constrain us and the things that actually let us get what we need to get done, get it done in a really focused way, and making really strategic decisions to say, you know what? My last five clients have come from referrals. I've never ever got a lead on social media. So do I need to be doing social media? Or why am I this is what I see all the time, building an email list, which is for people that are not buying retainer services. Like, get really clear on what that marketing is and then create a really simple system where you know what is the cadence. You're not having to reinvent the wheel. So if you are doing specific marketing activities, you have a plan. And I just call it, like, the minimally viable marketing plan.

Maggie Patterson [00:14:50]:
Like, please just start with that.

Andréa Jones [00:14:52]:
Yes. Please. Please. Please. I love that you use a referral example because there are so many times where people say that to me, oh, it's referrals referrals. And they desperately want they want the magic pill of social media, but they're marketing to the wrong people. Like, if referrals are your people, go after referrals. And, yeah, you can find them on social media, but you you gotta go into it with that mindset.

Andréa Jones [00:15:10]:
I love this. I love this. Okay. So we're staying solo. We are, you know, being strategic with our time. But at what point do we start outsourcing? So do you talk in the book about getting support even while staying solo? What does that look like?

Maggie Patterson [00:15:27]:
Yeah. So one of the pillars is support, and I feel like this is a really common place where people go wrong. They feel like solo means alone. Yeah. Like, nobody is a business owner. Nobody should be doing this alone. And support can take a lot of different forms. And this is you're like, how do you have a whole chapter on support? Well, I talk about entrepreneurial loneliness because it's a well documented and very studied thing at this point and the isolation that goes on.

Maggie Patterson [00:15:56]:
The fact that we all have different needs, we need different supports. And we often think of support as I need to hire a business coach or I need to hire a VA. Support can come in a lot of different forms. It can come in in terms of upscaling or, it can come in personal support. I talk about personal support all the time with my clients. And that a lot of times is the most impactful type of support. Hey. Your back hurts because you're spending a lot of time in your design.

Maggie Patterson [00:16:26]:
Maybe you need a massage. Oh, you're struggling with x, y, and z? Maybe you need therapy. Maybe you need your groceries delivered or a produce box. Like, the support we get does not have to come down to pure support in the business. It could be having a having a very specific tool. So looking at support from a, I can't do this by myself, you know, no business owner is an island type. And being like, where do I actually need support? And sometimes that's gonna be like, hey. I need some business friends because I haven't left my house, and I need to talk to people who get it because talking to my partner or my cats is not a healthy way to do this.

Andréa Jones [00:17:08]:
Yeah. Get the support. I like, my Walmart delivery guy, oh, man. That's my support right there. Can't do it. Can't do it without him. Okay. So let's talk about this idea of, okay, yeah, we're solo.

Andréa Jones [00:17:22]:
We have our support. But there's this concept that I I run into all the time where people wanna and if this is you, don't feel bad, but they wanna seem like they're bigger than they are. Right? Like they like they on the website, they're like, oh, we here's how we help everybody. Or like, somebody asked me the other day if my assistant was AI. They were like, oh, is Jemmy a real person? I'm like, what do you mean? Yeah. She's real she's a real person. Who's Jemmy? Yeah. Like, creating AI assistance to, like, make themselves seem like they're bigger than they are.

Andréa Jones [00:17:54]:
Why? Why do why do people do this? Do you know?

Maggie Patterson [00:17:58]:
I feel like this ties back to kind of the beginning of, like, the the business legitimacy thing. And you were in that series I did, the staying solo story series. One of the interviews I did with one of my longtime clients, she tells a story. This is Emily Gertenbach, and she tells a story about going to a networking event. And someone keeps badgering her about when she's gonna hire and how bad it made her feel. And there is this idea, like, if you don't have a team, employees, a brick and mortar, all these things, Are you even legit? Are you even real? You're just playing business in your office or at your kitchen table or whatever. And the reality is is that that it's about ego. It's about vanity.

Maggie Patterson [00:18:48]:
It's about so many things. And I I find it really interesting when, like, I will pop my team answers, emails in our, you know, shared inbox, but so do I. I will pop in and answer emails sometimes on the customer service side or different things. And people are, like, so surprised that it's actually me because we've all been conditioned in this online world to feel, like, these celebrity entrepreneurs running the businesses are untouchables, and we should be worshiping them. And the reality is is, like, people at this point in time, I'm gonna I'm gonna call it right now. They don't give a shit if you have a huge team. They care if you have skills and experience and you do what you say you're gonna do. Because, unfortunately, over the last ten years of the online business world, like, the bar is so low, it's in hell right now.

Andréa Jones [00:19:39]:
Oh, Lord. Am I wrong? You're not wrong. I do feel like, unfortunately, this is where we are in the service industry. And especially going into now. So now not only are we competing against the low expectations that other people have set in their business, but also AI. I feel like there's this assumption that it's such a magical thing that it's like people, people think it's the end all be all. And then they come to us and they expect us to be able to do things, or they expect AI to be able to do things that it can't. And it's like, okay.

Andréa Jones [00:20:14]:
So we're battling against two expectations here with this, which is just it's so freaking wild. I think we're just heading into a wild time. But like you said, when you go into your inbox and you answer an email, I think that actually helps people connect with you more. And it it kind of like bridges this gap right now between, like, there's so much information online that sometimes we just want a human being. It reminds me of like when you call the bank and you're like, give me the human. I don't want the automate I don't want the automated. Give me the human. I feel like that's where we are right now.

Maggie Patterson [00:20:48]:
Quick example this morning. My husband's off work. We need to get a railing installed on our front step because there's not one and it's dangerous. And it's been six years and we figure someone's gonna fall off eventually. So he he call basically gets in touch with two places. One person says, great. I'm in the area. I'm gonna come give you a quote.

Maggie Patterson [00:21:06]:
The other one says, hey. Can you take pictures and send a sketch?

Andréa Jones [00:21:10]:
Wait. They want you to sketch it? Yes. No.

Maggie Patterson [00:21:14]:
Yeah. That's why he's like, absolutely not. And I mean, the man is an artist. He can do it, but I'm he he was just like, no. So we think of that example in your business. Like, part of being a service business owner is actually providing service. And I feel like in the push to have boundaries and say no and, like, I support all those things. There's an entire chapter on boundaries in the book.

Maggie Patterson [00:21:35]:
But we need to remember, like, we actually need to be providing a service and doing what we say we're gonna do and not overpromising and not just trying to do the least amount of work for the most amount of money. Like, there needs to be some integrity in this. And, our mutual friend, Michelle Mazer, and I just recorded a episode of our podcast duped on AI and shitification. Because what I'm seeing is the coach to AI, you know, consultant pipeline is real. As the coaching industry is saying, we've got an AI industry replacing it. And I I use AI. I don't think it's bad. But when I see someone being like, pay for six weeks of coaching with my bot, Are you what are you on? Look.

Maggie Patterson [00:22:21]:
Yes. Oh, I saw it for real on the Internet.

Andréa Jones [00:22:25]:
Oh, man. I mean, I guess if we can think it, it's it's being done. Listen, I'm a huge fan of AI. I love using it. I talk to chatty, chattyPT every day. Sure. I love it. And it's like a calculator, man.

Andréa Jones [00:22:38]:
It's not it's not replacing the human anyways. Okay. I wanna shift gears a little bit because I wanna get a little bit nosy about your book marketing. I loved the podcast series that you did for your your book marketing. But before we get into that, I want you to give us the the overall 10 foot view, hundred foot view of your book marketing headed into the launch of Staying Solo.

Maggie Patterson [00:23:02]:
Oh my gosh. I'm just gonna say to anyone who wants to write a book, it is a lot of work as an indie author because it is me. And, like, yes, I have a team, but here's the reality. I have a very small team, and we've got an agency to run. We've got BS free business to run. And, like, I didn't know what I was doing, so I couldn't give really good instructions. So, I mean, I have lots of friends who've had books, everything who've given me lots of guidance, but I had to get really scrappy. Like, that was a lot of I had to do a lot of swipe files.

Maggie Patterson [00:23:33]:
I created a whole secondary podcast for it. You know, multiple episodes of my podcast. I've been doing all the podcast interviews. Like, this is 10,000 foot. This is a massive marketing project over and above everything else we are already doing. And I think the interesting thing is like, yes, there's the time and the energy and commitment of writing the book. And then there's the hard expenses of writing the book, which right now I'm looking at about $12,000 of, like, you know, what's gone into book marketing, copies, all sponsorships, all the things. I mean, that's I'm sure that cost will mount over time, which with my business model, we were I'm already starting to see that kind of be recouped.

Maggie Patterson [00:24:17]:
But if you have a business model where you're selling, like, $2 stickers, writing a book is not gonna be the way to go. Yeah. I mean, my year long masterminds, I sell a couple of those those expenses are recouped. And I didn't do it for necessary this, like, massive influx of business. I did it because I wanted to basically put everything together in one neat package, and it's a really good entry point for people into my world.

Andréa Jones [00:24:44]:
Yeah. I love this. To me, it's like, it's like the best business card you can ever

Maggie Patterson [00:24:49]:
Exactly.

Andréa Jones [00:24:50]:
Give out, right? Because if someone doesn't know who you are, I could buy the book and be like, Oh, here's everything you need to know. And then once you're done with that, come to me and I'll I'll give you the next step because Maggie has a lot of options, you know, and so I really like that you did that. I'm always impressed with people who could do this because, I do not have the patience. How long did it take you to write the book?

Maggie Patterson [00:25:11]:
A year. And I'm a write just for like, I am a writer. That is my that is my craft. That is my thing. I had a lot of existing material to pull together, but, oh, the I really went over the top with making the case and the research. Like, anyone who reads the book will be like, this is a very well researched and cited book. And if you don't like research, just skip the first three chapters and get into the guts. I literally have it like a how to use this book because that section is not for everyone.

Maggie Patterson [00:25:42]:
But if anyone wants to argue with me, I'd be like, see page 47. Let let me just

Andréa Jones [00:25:48]:
pull up my notes here and show you how it's done. I love this. Oh my gosh. This book is on my read list. Once I get, like, some time away from these little kids, I'm gonna dive into it. I already have a plan. I love this. So back to the private podcast.

Andréa Jones [00:26:03]:
I love private podcast because for me, especially in this season of my life, I need something audio that I can listen while we're out walking, doing j care drop off, all of this. How did that go and and embedded into the launch of the book?

Maggie Patterson [00:26:17]:
You know, that I'm really I really partway through was like, what have I done? Oh, no. I was like I was like, oh, wow. I just created a whole other project on top of the book, on top of everything else. Yeah. But I'm really glad we did it because number one, the Staying Solo podcast, I very, like, very, very, very rarely do interviews on that podcast. And there's so many people I wanted to talk to that were either featured in the book or kind of in my bigger world. And I was I really enjoyed having those conversations, and I've got so much positive feedback on it. And I'd have to look at the numbers, but I mean, right out of the gate, there was, like, a hundred downloads right there.

Maggie Patterson [00:26:58]:
Boom. Like and let me say a hundred I should say a hundred sign ups, It's not a hundred downloads. So, you know, that's getting it in front of those people. And it's the nice thing about it is the conversations are completely evergreen. So, you know, over the summer, hey, I'm gonna be like, hey, you missed the Staying Solo podcast we're on hiatus? Go listen to the private podcast. Because if there's one thing I am going to do with all this is repurpose it for all of eternity.

Andréa Jones [00:27:26]:
For here and now and forever. Amen. I love this. So I wanna talk a little bit about your goals from this because I do find that one of the hardest parts in marketing in general is once you set out to do the thing, it's after you've done it measuring the success of especially such a large campaign like this took you a year to write it, so much, investment to go into publishing self publishing. You're still on this marketing tour of it all. What are your goals? Let's let's give it an end date by the end of twenty twenty five. What are what would make this a huge success for you?

Maggie Patterson [00:27:59]:
What would make this a huge success for me is, a, I want books in hands and eyeballs reading the books. Right? Like, they're you know, it's multi step. Get the book in front of people, get them to read the book, and then hopefully get them into my world. And we are already seeing, you know, beyond those initial email sign ups around, the podcast. We've had some really meaningful list growth. I'd have to actually go look at the numbers, but meaningful for us. We don't have a giant list, in terms of just people signing up for the resource kit that goes with the book. I've had been able to have a lot of podcast conversations.

Maggie Patterson [00:28:34]:
So, you know, we're we're broadening the net because one of the things that I think would actually really interest people is my addressable community is not huge. Like, as much as I seem to be everywhere, you know, my list is not massive. I don't have massive social media following. I'm just really loud. I'm actually not that loud, but I'm loud around my marketing. Right? So, and if you actually look at the numbers, like, that is how I'm consistently able to outperform what my numbers say I should be able to do in terms of conversions and just engagement with my community. So, for me, this is just a awareness and a visibility exercise at this point. And, like, would I like to sell a thousand books by the end of the year? Yes.

Maggie Patterson [00:29:21]:
Do I think I'm going to? I don't know. Book reporting is really slow. I don't know where I'm at right now.

Andréa Jones [00:29:27]:
Yeah. I love that. Okay. I wanna go rewind a sec because you mentioned this resource kit. Is this something that's like at the end of the book, they get to the end of the book and you're like, hey, if you want more sign up?

Maggie Patterson [00:29:37]:
I have it sprinkled throughout the book.

Andréa Jones [00:29:39]:
Oh, nice. I love that. I think that's such a great way to encourage people to take that next step. Especially you mentioned things like calculators and like tangible things that you can implement with the book. Some of the books that stick with me, I always know that those are the things that go along with it. I love it. I love it. Okay.

Andréa Jones [00:29:58]:
So we're nearing the end of our conversation today. Last question. Do you think that solo businesses mean that the business is more human?

Maggie Patterson [00:30:11]:
I'm gonna say yes.

Andréa Jones [00:30:13]:
Tell me more.

Maggie Patterson [00:30:15]:
Well, I think and I'm gonna come at this from a couple different angles, is number one, you know, like, if you compare it to an agency, one of the big things everyone goes through when they transition from solo to an agency is convincing people that their team is as good as they are, if not better. And when you're a solopreneur, you never have to deal with that. So I feel like one of the biggest fears our clients have is, like, what makes you great is not gonna carry through. And whether it's true in an agency or not, I do feel like you being the face of the business also humanizes it. It's it's just an easier thing for brains to wrap around. Not saying agencies are not human. My team is very human, not AI. But at the end of the day, there's that.

Maggie Patterson [00:31:03]:
I think the other thing is a solo business owner, it's a lot easier to just build things, do your marketing based on your point of view, your reputation. Like, you don't have as many things to consider. And I'll give you an example. When I had a business partner, it was very challenging at times because not that we had differing viewpoints, but how I would express that versus how she would express it were very different. And I I'm glad I had that lesson because once we had wrapped up in pardon on very amicable terms, I always like to say that because business partnership breakups are always a thing on the Internet. And that actually was one of the reasons I was able to sharpen my voice because I was like, oh, no one's here to hold me back? Great. I can say whatever I want.

Andréa Jones [00:31:52]:
Yes. Yeah. You I do find that. So having been on both sides of this now, I feel more nimble, which is both a pro and a like, I don't think either side of this is, like, go all one way or the other. But, like, I can be very nimble with my marketing. Like, I can wake up today and be like, I'm gonna do this now and then just do it. Whereas before when I had a a team, there was, like, a lot of things to think about before doing that. But, also, it's just me.

Andréa Jones [00:32:19]:
So some days, lately, especially, where I've been sick this week y'all, I woke up. I was like, I don't feel like working today. And then I just don't work today. There's no one to report to. It's just me. So, I do find that that part like, having a team for me helped me stay more motivated versus, being nimble. So two sides, but I I love that you said that though about the humanity of it all. I find there's just gonna be a premium on humanity because of AI and robots and everything.

Andréa Jones [00:32:44]:
So I love this. Thank you so much, Maggie.

Maggie Patterson [00:32:47]:
And can I just I wanna add something to that? In a world of AI, in a world of where, you know, we have all these people that are separate and we can't talk to them. You being able to show up and be human and real and, like, actually serve your clients, connect with your clients, have conversations with your clients, and being willing to do that is a huge differentiator. So I think for anyone who's feeling uncomfortable about AI right now is, like, as a solo business owner, you have a huge advantage. And I will just say as someone who works on the agency side with corporate clients, I am seeing my corporate clients hire more and more solo practitioners than ever before because they don't wanna pay for the layers and complexity and, frankly, the bullshit that goes on with a lot of the agencies they've dealt with in the past.

Andréa Jones [00:33:34]:
Yeah. Interesting. Okay. Well, you heard it here first, folks. Staying Solo may be a way to go for you. I love this. Okay. So everyone who's listening is like, give me the book now.

Andréa Jones [00:33:45]:
Please, Maggie, tell us more about it and where they can find it.

Maggie Patterson [00:33:48]:
Okay. So the book you can find at stayingsolobook.com. It is everywhere. It is Amazon, Indigo, Barnes and Nobles, bookshop dot org. So if you don't wanna shop on the bad place, you don't have to shop on the bad place. And it's in oh, Kobo. Why did I say that? It's all literally all the places I've been indie authoring all over the place being like, hi. Can you stop my book? Yeah.

Maggie Patterson [00:34:09]:
Like I said, the humiliate of all this. It's been very, sobering.

Andréa Jones [00:34:15]:
Yeah.

Maggie Patterson [00:34:16]:
So that is the best place to find book is wherever books are sold. And if you wanna check out the Staying Solo Stories podcast, which includes Andrea's story, it's at stayingsolostories.com. And I live on the Internet at b s free business and the Staying Solo podcast. Yay.

Andréa Jones [00:34:31]:
I love it. All of those links will be in the show notes y'all onlinedrea.com/350nine. Get the book, listen to the podcast, enjoy all of it. Thank you so much, Maggie, for being on the show today.

Maggie Patterson [00:34:41]:
Thanks, Andrea.

Andréa Jones [00:34:42]:
And thank you, dear listener, for tuning into another episode of the Mindful Marketing Podcast. If you want more mindful marketing goodness in your life, make sure you check out the Mindful Marketing Lab. Coming up next, we are doing our famous what's the scoop session where I go into all the nitty gritty of all the marketing news and trends happening on the Internet, really breaking it down so that you have what you need to know and not all the hypotheticals out there in the world. So come on in. That's gonna be on June 3. So in the Mindful Marketing Lab, join us there. Next week, I am having a conversation with Lindsey Busfield all about unlocking the Google algorithm, especially that cute little box at the top right now that says, hey. Here's what AI says.

Andréa Jones [00:35:24]:
If you wanna learn about that and more, stay tuned next week. I'll see you then. Bye for now.